SHELF AWARE PODCAST
Be Mighty by Dr. Jill Stoddard Interview
Be Mighty by Dr. Jill Stoddard is *the* book to start off your reading list in 2020! It’s also my choice to start off this podcast. Listen as Jill and I discuss her new book Be Mighty, her writing life, why she wrote this book, favorite childhood books, and how you can live your own life with more meaning!
FIND DR. STODDARD AT WWW.JILLSTODDARD.COM
PSYCHOLOGY TODAY https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/experts/jill-stoddard-phd
FULL TRANSCRIPT OF EPISODE
Hi, and thanks for tuning in to the very first episode of self aware books podcast. In today’s episode, I’m getting to talk to Dr. Jill Stoddard, an amazing author of the new book being mighty A Woman’s Guide to liberation from anxiety, worry And stress using mindfulness and acceptance and Commitment Therapy. One quick update from the time we recorded this in 2020. Jill is also co host of Psychologists Off The Clock, a podcast about the science and practice of living. Well, the hosts are a couple of clinical psychologists who love to chat about the best ideas from psychology. It’s one of my favorite podcasts to listen to, and you can find it at psychologists off the clock calm. Okay, let’s listen. Welcome to shelf aware. And today we have Dr. Jill Stoddard, who I’m so excited to talk about her new book be mighty, which if you couldn’t have a more appropriate title for a book, I have come away calling myself a lava lady all day long after finishing her book. So welcome, Dr. Joe.
Dr Jill Stoddard 1:52
Jaime and thank you so much for having me.
Thank you. So a quick bio just for listeners just so we can lay the groundwork of who you are. Jill Stoddard, a founder and director of the Center for stress and anxiety management, a multi site outpatient clinic in San Diego, California. She specializes in acceptance and Commitment Therapy act in cognitive behavioral therapy CBT for anxiety and related issues. Stoddard earned her PhD in clinical psychology from Boston University in 2007. She’s an award winning teacher recognized act trainer and co author of The Big Book of active metaphors. She lives in San Diego with her husband, two kids into French Bulldogs, so I’m going to need see pictures of those French Bulldogs.
Dr Jill Stoddard 2:41
Oh, they’re pretty cute.
Oh, so thank you for talking to us today about your new book and process it took for you to get there all about writing it and who this book is for. So if you wouldn’t mind can you tell our listeners a little bit about your book be mighty
Dr Jill Stoddard 3:00
Yeah, absolutely. So the book is written for women who struggle with anxiety, worry stress. So you know, I sort of joke basically that just means it’s written for women. Because who doesn’t struggle with anxiety, worry and stress myself included. And I think it really is for any woman who is feeling stuck. You know, I think a lot of us feel the pressure of juggling the multiple demands of work and or school and kids and all of the difficulties of of just life and culture and being constantly bombarded by bad news. And it can feel a little overwhelming. And I think it can become easy to get stuck in all of that stuff and sort of lose sight of who we are, who we want to be and the kind of lives that we want. And that’s really what the mighty to do is to put readers in touch with the woman that they really most deeply desire to be and to sort of figure out like, what’s getting in the way of that, and how you can move past those obstacles and have a big, bold, mighty life.
Great. So your book be mighty. Do you remember how you came up with the title? Why do I want
Dr Jill Stoddard 4:25
to be mighty? Yeah, you know, that’s funny. It’s a good question, because the title is the very first thing that came to me and I want to say it was at least three years ago. And I had initially wanted to write just kind of a global self help act book acceptance and Commitment Therapy, and learned through the publisher that it’s important to have a niche so that, you know, people know who the book is for when they read the title. And at the time, it just, that just wasn’t really the book I wanted to write. So we kind of put it on Hold for a little bit. And then I decided I wanted to write the mighty for anxiety. And in talking with the publisher, it was actually her idea to write it for women, and it was when she made the suggestion, it was like the skies opened up. And that just hit me right in the fields. Like this is the book that this was meant to be all along, and it wouldn’t have been the right time when I came up with the idea, you know, a couple years before that. But I have been on my own journey since 2016, of kind of becoming, I guess, an emerging feminist. And, you know, and I think it’s just we’re at a time where a lot of women are struggling with the reality of life as a woman and some systemic oppression that still exists. So yeah, it all it all just sort of came together organically, but But took a few few years.
So tell me a little bit about the organic process that’s been going on. What in you made you want to write a book versus start a blog? versus just continue what you were doing in your private practice?
Dr Jill Stoddard 6:16
Hmm. Okay. So, I had written a book or co written with Nilo fari, The Big Book of Acts metaphors, which was a book written for practitioners, you know, clinicians who do acceptance and Commitment Therapy. And it was a very difficult but very rewarding process. And, you know, I’ve really come to enjoy writing but I’ve discovered over time that I’m less interested in you know, more technical or scientific kind of writing and was really feeling an urge to write more in my own voice. And, you know, one of my biggest professional values is trying to decide emanate these concepts that, you know I live act in my own personal life. And I 100% credited for the fact that I feel alive and have a sense of meaning and purpose. And it’s not because life is easy, but it’s, I feel like I’ve been able to really find my own values driven life because of act even in the sort of swirl of chaos that is life. And I it just feels really important to me to try to get those concepts out into the world and to do so in a way that is accessible to people. So I really wanted to write a self help book that I could use my own voice that I was hoping would, you know, connect well with regular humans, you know, and people who maybe aren’t necessarily going to therapy but are wanting to grow So so that’s really where the desire came for the book. And then, I guess kind of, in parallel with that I had been a professor at University. And in thinking about wanting to write more, it just sort of occurred to me that I was spending so much time editing other people’s dissertations, among other things, that there just wasn’t really the time to do my own writing. And I loved my job there, but I made the very difficult but values driven decision to leave the university and focus predominantly on my private practice seeing clients but I only need to see clients a few days a week to make the same amount of money. And so I it freed up two full days for me so when I decided to write the mighty I was able to go to my office and sit for eight hours on a Monday and Friday. Just write write, write, write, write. And I just loved it so much. And it made it a pleasure rather than a chore or something that was stressful. You know, when I wrote my first book, I had a full time job and a baby and it was just so difficult to squeeze it in. And, you know, I’ve now tried to kind of architect my life in such a way that I actually have time set aside for writing so that it can be a more enjoyable process.
Okay, I have a lot. I want to unpack through that one. So you mentioned a couple times values based living you talk about act. For the first part of the question. How would you break down act and how do you break down act for people who have never heard of this and I realized that this podcast it’s going to sound like this is the act fan club. But honestly, it sounds like you’re using act way I do as a philosophy. We’re living More or less? How do you break down act? And how do you describe it as being different from other models? Why would I even be interested?
Dr Jill Stoddard 10:10
Yeah, well then the main goal of act is to build psychological flexibility. So psychological flexibility is just the ability to be in the present moment with everything inside the skin box emotions, physical sensations, urges, fully and without defense, and make conscious deliberate choices to do what matters to do what you value. So it’s actually fairly simple in terms of what it is, though not necessarily easy in practice.
Definitely. So I’m going to quote you back to you as awkward as that sounds. At the end of her book, under the living fears, the finale chapter, Jill writes why I’m most definitely stone in perfect work in progress. I credit the past 18 years of learning, living and sharing act for giving me the tools to embrace pain, and live love and labor out loud. Because of act I experienced sweetness when I show up to the small moments with my kids, my husband, my friends and my dogs experience on wonder when I stopped to fully notice the ocean view, and breathtaking sunsets right outside my office. And Jill does continue on but one of the things that I really noticed in the book is this is not written from the voice of an expert. Tell us a little bit about why you felt Okay, and safe enough to write a book coming more from your voice. Whereas many self help books you read come from I am the expert and you should do this.
Dr Jill Stoddard 11:53
Hmm, yeah, I would say it. It’s really coming also from living act in that my most important or prioritized, personal value is authenticity. And that’s what I hope comes through in the book.
And it definitely does this. The tone in his voice is someone who’s sitting down next to you, not someone who’s dictating to you from the back. This is not a backseat driver book.
Dr Jill Stoddard 12:27
Well, in one of the in acceptance and Commitment Therapy, part of the therapeutic stance is exactly that. It’s that even when we’re in therapy with a client, this isn’t a relationship where, you know, I am the expert who is psychologically healthy and well and you are the patient who is broken and ill, but it’s that we’re just two human beings who both struggle and know pain and are trying to grow and you know, get through this in the best way that we can
You have a challenge out about that right now. Tell us about
Dr Jill Stoddard 13:04
Oh, gosh, yeah. So I have this incredible team of women who work for me at my clinic. And we actually went up to Washington to an act for empowering women training with the wonderful Robin Walzer and Ashley Leonard curtain. And part of what came out of that was us wanting to brainstorm what we might be able to do to empower women in our local community. And the six of us met. Gosh, it was just a couple weeks ago, actually. And we came up with this idea. We were all somehow got talking about how we’ve noticed this enormous spike in clients who are coming to the clinic, where the source of their suffering really seems to be coming from social comparison and that with social media You know, and this is nothing new. I guess we all know this. But all you know people looking at social media and feeling like everyone else is taking these brilliant vacations and has the perfect marriage and life and adorable kids and great job and are think they’re the only ones who are suffering, like everybody else has it all together, and they somehow don’t. And so we came up with this idea to break those social media myths. So we called it the share, don’t compare challenge. And we challenge people to post a video, basically saying what you see on social media is and you know, here are all the things that are shiny and nice about me. But the real me also and you know, here are some truths about the ways that I might be struggling that you don’t see on social media. And so the hashtags are shared, don’t compare and hashtag the real me and we’re just trying to get people to jump on board and show a little bit of their True, authentic selves so that we all know that we’re in this together, you know that our common humanity is that to be human is to know pain. And, you know, there’s a lot of healing and connecting over that.
And I’m really, really like all the responses we’ve seen so far. We’re recording this in November 2019. And so far, it’s been amazing to see people that I personally look up to be just as real and fragile and vulnerable as me. I know you must have read Bernie Brown. At some point.
Dr Jill Stoddard 15:38
I you know, I haven’t read a lot of her stuff. But of course, I’ve seen her TED Talk. I’ve seen her special on Netflix. And you know, of course, she’s a personal hero. She’s just amazing the work that she does, yeah.
And a lot of these videos that people are sharing to me are like, you know, that vulnerability He talks about wholehearted living.
Dr Jill Stoddard 16:03
So we keep talking about acceptance and Commitment Therapy and just for listeners, you know, you write about what acceptance is and what acceptance is not in the book. So when we’re talking about acceptance with this, what are you really talking about? We’re just supposed to suck it up and brush off our feelings and keep going.
Dr Jill Stoddard 16:22
Right? That’s what we do. Yeah, that that is a that is the popular fear that comes out as soon as you use the word acceptance. And the other word that is used synonymously is willingness. And I actually like this word a little bit better. It doesn’t seem to trigger the same responses acceptance, but acceptance and willingness certainly don’t mean giving up or giving in or resignation. And they also don’t mean, you know, liking or wanting things that are painful. You know, I joke in the book that would make you a masochist. And then you’d need to read an entirely different book, but it’s really referring to a willingness to help have what is already inside your skin anyway. So we have thoughts, we have emotions, we have physical sensations, urges, and they show up. This is part of being human and we don’t get to choose that they show up but we do get to choose how we respond to them. And it’s often not the pain, that is really the thing that’s causing the problem. It’s everything we do in response to try to mitigate the pain. You know, we are we are creatures who seek comfort. And that’s not always a problem. You know, if you take a couple Advil when you have a headache, that’s not necessarily a problem. But if you’re so unwilling to feel any pain that you’re taking, you know, for Advil every two hours, and now you have rebound headaches and an ulcer. Now it’s a problem. So willingness is about making space to allow for discomfort inside your skin. In so far as fighting it causes issues and often pulls away from the life we want or the person we want to be, or in other words, our values.
And I think that’s so important. And it’s one of the things that makes this book definitely different from the 4 million other self help books or psychology based books that are out there. Another quote from the book that I really liked, if you’re looking for another book to tell you how to get rid of anxiety and find the key to ultimate happiness, this is not the book for you. She goes on to say we’re going to dig deep and feel feelings, you will not learn how to control, avoid or fix the anxious feelings you don’t want. Nor will you learn how to have more of the feelings you do want. Instead, you will learn to change your relationship to anxiety so it no longer holds you back. So when you say these things to people face to face. I’m sure they do not react with enthusiasm to this.
Dr Jill Stoddard 18:57
Yeah, I think it can be a little surprising because certainly In therapy, people are coming to feel better. So in some ways, it’s it’s sort of disappointing to find out that I don’t see my role as taking your pain away. But I pose it more as if I could, I would. But I can’t. That’s just not how it works. And anyone who says they can, you know, is lying to you. And, and then the way to get the buy in is really not. Because I’m an expert, and I’m saying it’s true, but to really look at what their experience tells them. So when we look at all the ways that pain and discomfort show up, and we look at all the things that you’re doing in response to that, what do you notice? And you know, people can pretty easily come to the conclusion that everything that they’ve been doing works in the short term in the short term in the book, I say it works or we wouldn’t do it. over and over and over, because it’s true, everything we do gets us something, it has a purpose or a function. You know, procrastination is a great example because that’s certainly something we all do. And in that moment, you give yourself permission to put something off, there’s a relief there. So it works in the short term, but of course, in the long term, there’s just as much to do and not as much time to do it. And so it actually makes everything you know, especially the thoughts and feelings that we were trying to get rid of in the first place it it makes all of those things bigger. Definitely. And people get that, you know, they they understand that it doesn’t take long before they go Oh, geez, you’re right.
So when they come up to you and ask, Is it okay that I take the bubble bath? How do you respond?
Dr Jill Stoddard 20:50
Oh, it’s absolutely okay to take the bubble bath. So, you know, this isn’t like therapy that says no pain, no gain or like there’s some glory and feeling pain. For pain sake, and if there are self care strategies that make people feel better, and they don’t have a cost, then that’s 100%. Okay, I love a bubble bath or yoga or meditation. It really is a question of what is it in the service of and doesn’t have a cost. So, you know, if you need to take a three hour bubble bath every single evening after work and you’re not spending any time with your kids, when being a good parent and spending quality time with your kids is something that really matters to you. Now, the bubble baths have a cost now the pursuit of feeling better feeling relaxed, has superseded these other important values of spending quality time with family.
I really like that good blood and I’ll continue taking my bubble bath.
Dr Jill Stoddard 21:54
you absolutely should.
And many times you know you hear about well Self Care is and isn’t important. It isn’t going to change anything in the world. You know, what does it matter if I’m meditating on the cushion, and I really like how your book handles the broader contextual or all those things that we know are in the environments, systematic. All those issues that we know are out there and she does Jill does adjusted in the book and I realized I’m talking third person in front of you. But I want the listeners to hear this. This other quote, she has a section called acceptance is not. Hopefully it’s pretty clear that when we talk about acceptance and willingness, we are specifically talking about acceptance of internal experiences. We’re not talking about acceptance of situations. For example, we are not talking about acceptance of sexist behavior or abuse. We’re talking about acceptance of the hurt, anger and sadness that arise when we are mistreated, especially in so far as acceptance as acceptance expands our options for freely choosing what to do and how to do it. And I think that’s so important in this day and age is this is not another improve yourself plan. And if you were in a bad situation well, so sorry.
Dr Jill Stoddard 23:15
Yes, absolutely, critically important. And in fact, if you’re in a bad situation, then getting in touch with values will likely help you to figure out what needs to be done or changed in order to remove yourself from that situation. But that’s different from trying to do things to to just feel better when when there is, you know, emotional pain that arises as a result of that bad situation.
So tell me a little bit broader. This book certainly distills down the work that you’re doing when you’re not writing a book. Tell me a little bit about the work you do at the center and all those things that you consider to be living Your values.
Dr Jill Stoddard 24:02
Well at the clinic, we see all people who have you know, anxiety, worry, panic, obsessive compulsive disorder, post traumatic stress, everything that’s kind of in the anxiety and stress family. We see adults and kids and couples, I only see adults, but I have a team of other women. So we try to serve as many different types of people as we possibly can. individual and group format. So that’s what I do. But you know, that’s what I spend most of my professional time on. And then the rest of the time is writing. You know, I’m done with this book, but I already have ideas about the next book I’d like to write. I love doing podcasts and I’ve done a handful of those and I actually do a fair amount of training not really teaching anymore. I used to teach but I’m a peer reviewed act trainers. So I will do trainings out in the community that are basically taking the concepts from the book, and doing different kinds of trainings in the community. So I’ve done trainings for trainees, like mental health trainees, postdocs, and interns and students. So I will do trainings in the community of people who are training in mental health. I’ve actually given a couple trainings at schools for parents on you know, identifying values in terms of how you want to be parenting differ different things like that. And then I just recently started blogging for psychology today. So that’s more writing but a different type of writing. So things are starting to shift a little bit. Doing a little less clinical work and a little bit more speaking, and writing and training. And I mean, I love doing all of it, and I’m someone who likes To Wear several different hats, all of which point to spreading the word about acceptance and Commitment Therapy.
Well, and and that’s something I want to ask you about. So, you know, I am seeing a trend in Yes, definitely clinicians, and therapists are doing individual one on one work, but I’m seeing a trend where people are moving to spread this farther and outside of the therapy office. So people who have never been diagnosed with anything but feel stressed and overwhelmed and maybe wouldn’t identify as anxious, but maybe they have an inner critic, or maybe their mind is always telling them that they’re an imposter and they’re fake and they should just go back to bed. And never mind today would know what that feels like at all. This is the work that you’re doing to reach people outside of the therapy room. Why is this important to you?
Dr Jill Stoddard 27:00
Yeah, that’s, uh, you, you hit the nail on the head 100%. And, you know, I have yet to find anyone. If I asked. You know, I’ll ask a roomful of people, does anyone not have some version of an I’m not good enough story, and literally no one has ever raised their hand. And the same goes for the imposter syndrome or inner critic. I mean, this really does seem to be a universal human experience. And so irrespective of whether someone has quote unquote symptoms, or a syndrome or something that would kind of count as a diagnosis. I think, you know, we all we all know pain, we all struggle, we all suffer. And I think anything that can reach as many people as possible to say, Hey, there is a way to live, you know, a big bold life to feel alive to feel fulfilled and have meaning Even in the midst of all of the things that are just very hard about being human, it’s I think you’re right, there are more and more people who one on one, therapy is amazing. And it’s so powerful. And I feel so grateful to be able to do this work with my life. And there’s nothing better than when you reach someone who’s really stuck. And you see their life change. And I’ve always believed that has a butterfly effect that if you can change one person, and then that person’s changes are kind of positively impacting other areas of your life, you’re having a big impact. But there’s also you know, this opportunity to reach more and more people who aren’t walking through the door. And I think that’s especially true when, you know, the stigma around mental health and psychotherapy is certainly improving but it’s not gone. And that’s true in you know, more true in certain cultural circles than others. And there are a lot of people who don’t have the resources to afford psychotherapy. And I think podcasts and books and blogs, you know, these are ways that more and more different types of people from different, you know, different cultural groups and different socio economic statuses, you know, we can just get the word out to so many more people, and all people need this kind of these kinds of skills.
So you’re normalizing that being human can suck sometimes
Dr Jill Stoddard 29:37
100% a lot of the time.
So where are you hoping that your work goes, you know, 10 years from now you look back, what do you hope you will have accomplished?
Dr Jill Stoddard 29:52
Well, it’s an interesting it’s a timely question, because I’m actually working with a consultant right now on this This exact question because I’m really feeling my heart being pulled in the direction of doing more personal writing, writing that really combines my knowledge and skill around act and psychotherapy and psychology in general, but also has a more personal bend to it. I think when when I see what people connect with and the writing I’ve done so far, the feedback does seem to center around my voice and the accessibility and exactly what you said feeling like you’re sitting next to a friend talking and I really love doing that. I really love writing in that way and and after leaving the university and building in time to write and having that work so well. I’m hoping to do even more of that. And then and then to be able to take what I’m writing about and be able to speak and teach and train. You know, these are really this is the direction I see myself. But it’s still very much a work in progress. And I’m, I’m actively thinking about it right in this moment in time in my life, but I’m not really sure, I will say that I am halfway through an application to do a TED talk. So I’m putting that out there in the world, even though I feel talk about imposter syndrome. You know, I feel like Who am I that I could go do a TED Ted TEDx talk, right, a smaller TED Talk. But I will go ahead and put it out there because like I said, I do live this act stuff and getting the word out about act feels really important to me, and what better way to reach a lot of people than through a TEDx talk. And so that’s, that’s kind of a that’s a goal that’s on the near horizon for me. And I’m actually attending the TED women’s conference. Gosh, it’s next. Next week, I believe in Palm Springs. So I’m just so looking forward to two days of massive inspiration. And I’m hoping to, I don’t know, learn, learn there about how I might improve my chances of being able to follow some of these new pursuits.
I love how you are in the boat with us. Just because you are highly trained does not mean that your mind automatically behaves and never gives you anxiety and that you were just like the rest of us, which comes across in your writing. Definitely. So you’re working to affect others and affect the future, who have been some of your influences. And do you have any books that you thought of when you were trying to write your own?
Dr Jill Stoddard 32:51
Well, the first person that comes to mind who just is my absolute, Shiro and I even talk about her a bit in the book is Oprah I think Oprah is just such an incredible example of someone who faced sexism, racism, poverty, abuse, I mean, any obstacle you could possibly think of. Oprah has encountered it and she has powered through and persevered and has always been her authentic self. And I just think that that is so incredibly admirable and she continues to be that way and she uses her power for good. You know, she has so much influence. And she uses it, she uses it for good. So she is kind of my number one. I very much look up to Abby Wan back. And her book wolf pack is, I mean, it has to be at the top of my list. It’s a quick if anyone hasn’t read it. It’s incredible. It’s only about 100 pages. And it’s just very inspiring. Talk about just a mighty woman and someone who trying to encourage other women to be mighty. Even my seven year old daughter read it. And if you asked her her favorite book, she would probably say wolf pack is right up there. Which is pretty cool. Definitely.
Are there other books or you know, before you were a professional, you know, what were some of your childhood favorite books?
Dr Jill Stoddard 34:23
Oh my gosh, well, I am a huge reader I, I read every single night before I go to bed, and I have pretty bad insomnia. So whenever I’m awake at two in the morning or four in the morning, I’m reading, reading, reading and that is the time that I reserved for my fictional pleasure books. So they have, you know, very little to do with psychology. I mean, of course, they have psychological themes, but they’re not self help books. They’re not psychology books. So let’s see some of my favorites. I loved the help. So good. Don’t remember author’s names. And in fact, I often don’t remember the titles of books because I read on a Kindle. So I never see. You never see the cover of your bed so you don’t know what you’re reading. I had, I have some friends I exchange, you know, read this book, read that book. And she sent a recommendation and I said, Oh, I’m gonna go download the sample now. And I looked on my Kindle. It was literally the last book I had just read.
Unknown Speaker 35:25
So I don’t remember who wrote
Unknown Speaker 35:26
right, Amazon should pay attention to this. Right? Right.
Dr Jill Stoddard 35:30
So the help was one of my favorites, the language of flowers, a beautiful book, the kitchen house. I just read Jojo Moy his most recent book, the giver of stars. I think it’s called it is the giver of stars. And that was excellent. That was one of the best books I’ve I’ve read in a while. I mean, as a kid, you asked what books did I like growing up? I mean, everything by Judy Blume tells me you’re crazy. Nothing super fetch. Are you there? God, it’s me, Margaret. I read all the Beverly Cleary Ramona books. my very favorite picture book at that time was corduroy. But now as a mom who reads lots of books, it’s beautiful by Dan Santa’s best kids book ever love it?
That is fantastic. And yes, that’s exactly why this is a nonfiction book podcast, because I am horrible at finding fiction books and sitting down and reading them. So I always enjoy recommendations, especially strong recommendations for what I should go and read in fiction. And I’m right with you and I even have the quarter or a T shirt. Oh, yeah. I can walk down any place and people will run up to me, oh my gosh, I loved corduroy. So if you’re ever feeling self conscious and shy, but you still want to meet people I recommend you put on a corner or a T shirt and go wherever you’re going that you’re intimidated, because people instantly fall over you and tell you all about their love of corduroy.
Dr Jill Stoddard 37:12
Well, now I’m gonna have to incorporate that into the next self help book. That would be a great willingness exercise for people to practice, especially people who have some social anxiety.
Exactly. Or the other one is bring out a golden retriever. That would be my other. Definitely. Well, I really appreciate all of your time and all of your talents, and your willingness to share all of your wealth of learning with all of us and talking to us today. Is there anything how do we find you? Are you on social media? Your websites?
Dr Jill Stoddard 37:47
Yes, I’m everywhere. So my website is just my name Jill Stoddard calm. I’m on Twitter. I, oh, my gosh, I don’t even know all my social media handles, but I think it’s Jill underscore Stoddard. And those are the two main places. I actually have an author page on Facebook that I’m planning to, you know, make announcements about book signings or podcast episodes. Or if people want to interact with me and have a conversation about the book, I would love to do that and on any of those platforms,
and be mighty is available for pre order. At this time, I do plan on this podcast launching just slightly before the book goes live in the beginning of January 2020. But if the pre order is over, by the time you’re listening to this, please go to Amazon or your favorite book seller and look for being mighty by Jill stouter. Thank you so much.
Dr Jill Stoddard 38:43
Thank you, Leanne. It was fun to chat with you. Thanks. Take care.
Unknown Speaker 38:47
Unknown Speaker 38:50
A big thank you for everyone listening to this episode of shelf aware books. You can find me at www shelf hyphen, awareness. dot com. That’s shelf dash aware.com. And you can also find me on firstname.lastname@example.org. Slash shelf, underscore, aware. underscore. Yes, double underscores. Don’t forget I want to hear from you. You can even leave a voice recording asking me anything you want about books or situations and you’re trying to read your way out of you can go to my website, shelf dash aware.com and leave a voice message on speakpipe. And remember shelf care is self care.
Transcribed by https://otter.ai